spaceballs_3000 wrote:
Business, and technological oddities that make you go 'huh?'
1. KP could fund whole project, why didn't they.
2. Mort Topfer could fund whole project, why didn't they.
Wier does not want them (or any investor) to get controlling interest. Also they are not interested in running the company.
3. Lightevs license, EEStor needs money.
4. Zenn license, EEStor needs money
Both true, DW does not like the strings attached by previous investors. Selling licenses is a way to raise capital without paying interest or losing control.
5. LM license, no money exchanged hands.
I found that strange too, but Wier gives a reasonable explanation in the "leaked interview". I am sure the deal sets prices profitable to EEStor.
7. Zenn investing money into AEC (new power source), and AEC is now gone.
I am sure Ian Clifford learned some lessons from that. 1. to do more due diligence. 2. Fantastic claims can be used to raise capital on the stock market.
8. Announcements like permittivity but at low voltage, i.e. no energy density can be calculated.
9. DW says no new science, if EESU exists (permittivity+HV), it's *'new science'. *'new science' = New unknown method of creating ceramic capacitor with ultra high energy density.
Been discussed to death. ED was not a requirement, proof of being able to make production quantities of purified powder was. Semantics about what consists of "new science".
12. DW says it's easy to manufacture, though it's been many years now.
I don't believe it's easy to manufacture either, I think he means he could figure out a way to do it cheaply.
13. DW says EESU will be safe, I've read up on patents, nothing to date in patents can back up this if component is cracked/crushed.
I believe there is some discussion about fuses in the patents. Safety will be confirmed when he gets UL approval. This could be a legitimate reason for delay.
16. Zenn Says they visit EEStor frequently, yet they delay announcements like it's all new to them.
Ever hear of a NDA?
17. Recent AGM, Zenn speaker acknowledges permittivity milestones is what *really* determines if EESU can exist or not. Since Zenn says they work closely with EEStor, one would think this would be determined a long time ago.
Agreed. See prior comment about permittivity.
18. IC says “… ZMC has always had internal and 3rd party subject matter experts who are knowledgeable…” Yet why did they invest in AEC then?
See lesson learned above.
19. If EEStor patents did work, it would have been copied already by countries that don’t uphold patent law.
Patents do not contain enough information on how to build an EESU, just some properties of it.
20. IC said last year that it's "Imminent"
Wier is lousy at estimating how long it takes to accomplish something. Same with me, I only see that the most difficult problems have solutions, and underestimate the time for all the other details.
21. KP is touting other battery technologies now.
EEStor is not going to wipe out all competition. KP will make money on these investments too.
24. There's no physics theory that supports the idea of any material doing more than 2% of what they claim.
You know this? By authority of Y_Po I suppose.
25. Weir and Nelson have never published anything, not even a thesis.
Best way I know of to keep something secret is to not tell people.
26. The most intelligent experts in the field have the greatest skepticism "beyond fantasy".
Standard procedure for anything new.
27. EEStor's most highly-valued agreement is with a photographer's company that has a dismal financial history of assembling pre-made parts for fancy golf carts.
Yea, that bothers me too.
28. Billions of these capacitors are already made each years at 20 times the cost EEStor claims it can do. Even cost of pure BT does not jive with making $5,000 units.
DW does his own purification, and keeps costs down. But yeah, how can he do it for significantly less than AVX?
31. There are no positive indications that EEStor will ever do what they claim.
There are plenty, if you take faith of investors and visits by politicians and investigators as positive indications.
32. PET cannot withstand more than 0.5% of the voltage they want to apply.
I don't understand the theory well enough, but it seems to be accepted practice and not required.
34. SME said "he does not think EEStor will succeed."
35. SME said "it was still sketchy information and it is "not the obvious measurement one would want to make to demonstrate the claims unless they are hiding something. "
36. SME said "... Bottom line is the jury is still out, there is a lot yet to be shown."
37. SME said I think these people are scientists and I think they have made an interesting discovery but their explanations of what they have discovered are not reasonable...
All that he says is that he cannot explain everything, and furthermore will not explain parts he does understand because of contractual agreements. Never actually denies the possibility, in fact implies he thinks it does work.
38. ZENN Confirms EEStor's Third-Party Certified Permittivity Results, but no mention of energy density numbers, or having it tested at high voltage ~4,000v.
Repeat of above, ED proof was not a requirement.
39. From (SME) Mike Lanagan, publicly we only have 25% of the information needed to compute energy density to date. i.e. capacitance (unknown), breakdown voltage (unknown), volume (unknown), Loss (known)
40. From IC I got a call from Dick Weir late in 2002 and he was at the point where he and his partner Carl Nelson were getting ready to commercialize the technology that they had developed 10 years previously.
41. Mike Bergeron (VP of engineering at ZENN) interview: "So, I too am anxiously awaiting at voltage testing.", "I'll be the absolute true believer when I get to test it at voltage."
None of these mean anything.
42. Mike Bergeron (VP of engineering at ZENN) interview: "... But at the time I was working for Chrysler. And Dick had approached me and I brought this opportunity up to Chrysler.", "Well, obviously it didn't go."
That was explained, Chrysler, (in fact any large company) would not sign a NDA.
43. Mort Topfer has left EEStor. *Note he has left AMD also too.
How old is Mort Topfer? Well beyond the age most people retire.
44. Interview with Mort Topfer, "B: And so..... it has the energy density that they say that it has?" "Topfer: Well, they showed me reports that say that. Correct."
What did you expect him to say? A major part of keeping EEStor from being buried by competitive interests is secrecy and keeping us all guessing.
45. Few EEStor investors passed up the chance to invest more into EEStor, thus Zenn is able to get more, and now owns approximately 10.7% of the equity of EEStor. Why would existing EEStor investor(s) pass up this chance?
I like Whiskythief's explanation, the other investors were family, and they did not have more money to invest.
46. Missed 2009 delivery: Ian Clifford - ... EEStor made the public statement that they anticipate having at-voltage components verified independently by September of this year and deliver of production prototype EESU to us by then end of 2009. That’s directly from EEStor. ...
There was no promise of public disclosure of independent tests in September. However delivery is another thing, the day is not over.
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof :)
Agreed.
I do have one extra thing to add. If this is a hoax, one thing to do would be to create a mining company like Stardust with only cheap barren land and a web site for assets and put a "leaked" interview on it.
Happy New Year.
Last edited Thu, 31 Dec 2009, 11:06am
by Innovator
Once I stood at the side of the highway looking south watching the light show in the sky. Many others stopped, watched and left talking about UFOs. Finally the full moon appeared from behind the clouds.
